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Is Tagg actually the problem at ECFC?

Edward

Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2010
Messages
756
The future direction of the club is a matter for shareholders: they should not abdicate that responsibility or accept that the future can be determined by any club employee. Right now, there seems to be confusion over whether the priority is developing talent or winning games. Both have merit and both could probably co-exist but there has to be clarity. And that requires a very clear plan to be communicated to the staff, the shareholders and all the other stakeholders. The content of that plan must reflect the preferences of shareholders and that means that each Trust member should contribute; they have paid for that privilege. It would be helpful if the executive were supportive of the plan: if not, it can simply be passed by resolution at an AGM/EGM. The executives would then be entrusted with its delivery and liable to termination if they were unwilling or unable.

Having some money in the bank – and there must be plenty left – is not a reason for continuing to run the business poorly. And trusting the use of that cash to some of the very folk who directed the club to the precipice of insolvency is a brave move. Of course, it is possible that Messrs Mason and Lee have knocked some sense into Tagg but I would suggest the Trust seeks to protect its investment in a more robust manner.

In my view, the Club Board should be no more complicated than a CEO and Finance Director and two non-executives; one should be appointed by the Trust, the other should be independent of the Trust and Club. The first two positions would be salaried club employees whilst the Trust and Club should cover the fees for the two non-execs respectively. The non execs have to be paid: you are never certain to attract the best candidates if you favour volunteer contributions.

The Trust Board shouldn’t be that complicated either. Find a Chairman (pay them) who will act as a figurehead – Ade Edmondson would be a decent choice – in order to sell the ‘we own our club’ concept to the widest possible community. If Edmondson is too busy/not interested, at the very least find somebody who is engaging and doesn’t act like a ***** every time they make a public comment. And create a very real distinction in the minds of the public between the Trust and the Club. It should be a compelling story which is somewhat unique and easily told. The Trust should also appoint somebody (on a part-time salary) who can leverage the goodwill generated by the Chairman to bolster Trust income via increased membership especially amongst local businesses. The right person would pay for themselves several times over: it shouldn’t be too tricky to increase annual Trust revenues to £200k even if the only product on offer is membership.

After that, you can have as many Trust sub-committees as you like because you have a) taken better care of your investment by improving the oversight on the board and b) protected/enhanced your own Trust revenues. These sub-committees can be manned by enthusiastic volunteers who can all focus on their particular area of interest. It would be helpful if they could embrace the talents of the wider membership too so there is a real sense of a communal effort. The regular Trust board meetings can collate the views which need to be communicated to the non-exec representing the Trust. Right now, the effort is so dismal and the interest is so lacking that the Trust either didn’t meet in July (as scheduled) or didn’t think it was necessary to post the minutes.

Oh, and I have no idea whether Tagg is CEO or Chairman nowadays. He is reported in the media as being the Chairman but I suspect he is also the CEO (after the ludicrous decision to mess around with the woefully inadequate GW). That said, I do know that the UK Corporate Governance Code frowns on a) anybody holding the two positions simultaneously or b) a CEO being elevated to Chairman (and thereby potentially impacting the performance of any new CEO). The Trust has failed miserably if they have allowed Tagg to perform both roles: it wouldn’t be a smart idea even if he was outstanding.
 

Sexton Blake

Well-known Exeweb poster
Joined
Dec 16, 2011
Messages
8,872
"The prestige of being a Director of ECFC" You are joking aren't you David?....please say you're joking.....
Malcs you should know as well as anybody that David is not joking that is exactly how it used to be in days gone by probably the most memorable being Bob Lord who was a butcher in his home town Burnley. Incidentally for all his faults I believe the much maligned Ivor Doble also gave at lot to ECFC with very little financial reward.

The sad fact is that once we changed from tens of thousands cap wearing supporters watching eleven players whose wages were at a similar level to just thousands watching overpaid and at times millionaires and prima donnas the whole fabric and dynamics of the game changed drastically.

It is now and has been for many decades even before the birth of the Prem no longer a sport and is solely a business requiring people with business skills to run it. Your average fan does not have these skills which is why all this nonsense of fans on the Board and fans being so called owners of Clubs is just that......so much nonsense.

I only wish it were different because as we are seeing Clubs are now being bought and run by individuals both British and foreign with few if any having any background of being involved with sports based businesses ie Football Clubs and the uniqueness of such a business. So what are they in there for? Sure as hell very few have any philanthropic type tendencies and in reality are just in it for what they can get out of it. In many cases it seems just to get their hands on the Club's real estate.

It does not bode well for the future of the Club that we all love and indeed for the mid to lower echelons of the EFL. We can only hope and pray that whoever is at the helm will put all self interests aside recognise that they are effectively caretakers and do whatever they can to keep the Club healthy. In our case I feel we can but hope
 

arthur

Very well known Exeweb poster
Joined
Aug 18, 2004
Messages
11,871
The future direction of the club is a matter for shareholders: they should not abdicate that responsibility or accept that the future can be determined by any club employee. Right now, there seems to be confusion over whether the priority is developing talent or winning games. Both have merit and both could probably co-exist but there has to be clarity. And that requires a very clear plan to be communicated to the staff, the shareholders and all the other stakeholders. The content of that plan must reflect the preferences of shareholders and that means that each Trust member should contribute; they have paid for that privilege. It would be helpful if the executive were supportive of the plan: if not, it can simply be passed by resolution at an AGM/EGM. The executives would then be entrusted with its delivery and liable to termination if they were unwilling or unable.

Having some money in the bank – and there must be plenty left – is not a reason for continuing to run the business poorly. And trusting the use of that cash to some of the very folk who directed the club to the precipice of insolvency is a brave move. Of course, it is possible that Messrs Mason and Lee have knocked some sense into Tagg but I would suggest the Trust seeks to protect its investment in a more robust manner.

In my view, the Club Board should be no more complicated than a CEO and Finance Director and two non-executives; one should be appointed by the Trust, the other should be independent of the Trust and Club. The first two positions would be salaried club employees whilst the Trust and Club should cover the fees for the two non-execs respectively. The non execs have to be paid: you are never certain to attract the best candidates if you favour volunteer contributions.

The Trust Board shouldn’t be that complicated either. Find a Chairman (pay them) who will act as a figurehead – Ade Edmondson would be a decent choice – in order to sell the ‘we own our club’ concept to the widest possible community. If Edmondson is too busy/not interested, at the very least find somebody who is engaging and doesn’t act like a ***** every time they make a public comment. And create a very real distinction in the minds of the public between the Trust and the Club. It should be a compelling story which is somewhat unique and easily told. The Trust should also appoint somebody (on a part-time salary) who can leverage the goodwill generated by the Chairman to bolster Trust income via increased membership especially amongst local businesses. The right person would pay for themselves several times over: it shouldn’t be too tricky to increase annual Trust revenues to £200k even if the only product on offer is membership.

After that, you can have as many Trust sub-committees as you like because you have a) taken better care of your investment by improving the oversight on the board and b) protected/enhanced your own Trust revenues. These sub-committees can be manned by enthusiastic volunteers who can all focus on their particular area of interest. It would be helpful if they could embrace the talents of the wider membership too so there is a real sense of a communal effort. The regular Trust board meetings can collate the views which need to be communicated to the non-exec representing the Trust. Right now, the effort is so dismal and the interest is so lacking that the Trust either didn’t meet in July (as scheduled) or didn’t think it was necessary to post the minutes.

Oh, and I have no idea whether Tagg is CEO or Chairman nowadays. He is reported in the media as being the Chairman but I suspect he is also the CEO (after the ludicrous decision to mess around with the woefully inadequate GW). That said, I do know that the UK Corporate Governance Code frowns on a) anybody holding the two positions simultaneously or b) a CEO being elevated to Chairman (and thereby potentially impacting the performance of any new CEO). The Trust has failed miserably if they have allowed Tagg to perform both roles: it wouldn’t be a smart idea even if he was outstanding.
I am rejoining the Trust
 
Joined
Aug 17, 2016
Messages
719
I am new to this place but after a long time of watching City and reading this forum I have finally felt the urge to join.

There are so many things wrong with this club at the moment and whilst I appreciate the “join the Trust Board and do something about it” comments, not everyone can do this and certainly if you do not have any faith in the Trust model as I don’t then this is not an option. My main gripes are:

1. “We are no ordinary club” mantra that keeps getting trotted out. Well I for one did not ask for an abnormal club to support. I just want to be able to go and watch my football club play football with some interest and passion again as was always the case until the last 5 years or so. I am not interested in the 3g pitches, community work, fair play awards etc. I just want to see 11 players in their correct positions giving it their all and playing with freedom in a positive manner. Why do we feel the need to go to Brazil? Why is winning a football match not the ultimate aim? Why can’t we be an ordinary football club?!
2. Paul Tisdale. I am not going to waste time repeating what many others on here and Social Media are already saying but the man is a disgrace. He represents everything that is wrong with this club and the director it is going in. It is well known that is he the highest paid manager in this league which I would have less problem with if he did not constantly bleat about “lack of funds”. If we are that short then scrap your £125k salary and put it in the budget! Here is a radical idea, get 2 players in each position who do not have a history of injuries and are not over 35, play simple football and see what happens. You may be surprised! His attitude towards the fan base is pure contempt andhow he gets away with it is beyond me.
3. Steve Perryman. What is his role? Does he still get paid a ridiculous figure (used to be circa £80k) to do absolutely nothing? His time at the club must come to an end unless he is a non-paid ambassador of some sorts.
4. Julian Tagg. What else can be said about this man? His ramblings in the press are an embarrassment and his blind faith in Paul Tisdale is beyond comprehension. The sooner he goes or realises that we are meant to be professional football club rather than a sporting academy the better.
5. The supporters. Probably the biggest culprits of all in my opinion. The fact that I am still reading “it’s early in the season, give Tisdale 10 games…” is unbelievable. This is not a flash in the pan bad start or something new. It is 5 years of unacceptable home form and excuses now. How can anyone honestly believe Tisdale is still the best man for the job? The unambitious lethargic attitude of our supporters is the most shameful thing in all of this. “We have always been rubbish, we are at our level” drives me mad. Is football not about hope and dreams? Should I not be able to think one day Exeter City could be an established Championship team or even do a Blackpool, Hull, Swansea, Burnley, Fulham, Wigan etc and have a spell in the top flight? I know all of the aforementioned clubs had money injected but if someone did ever approach us to invest I honestly do not think we would ever know about it and they would be quietly pushed away in order to protect the tripartite farce of Tisdale, Perryman & Tagg.

I am glad I got that off my chest, after all that is what forums are for I believe.
 

Grecian O'Grecian

Well-known Exeweb poster
Joined
Apr 4, 2013
Messages
5,961
Really good post.

I've got to the stage where I'm unfortunately pretty apathetic about the whole club. You just know what you'll get from us. You know we won't put right the home form or defensive frailties which have been the major problems the past 5 or so years, you know we will pick up next to no points between December - February, and you know it'll be the same the season after. I don't think we have any ambition to progress on the pitch, Tis, Tagg & Perryman will all rather us have an above average academy, even if it means neglecting the first team.

I'm just bored of it all. Gone past the point of wanting to scream and shout about it. I'm just resigned to the fact that nothing will change.
 
Joined
Sep 21, 2014
Messages
534
Location
Exeter
I can't see the argument for NOT giving Tis 2 years notice - it could have been " it will adversely affect his motivation" - but as we're bottom of the league anyway how much worse can it get ? He's a nice guy form what I'v seen but clearly has zero motivation and no imperative to do anything.

The academy is a good argument but he doesnt run this !
 

denzil

Active member
Joined
Jan 5, 2005
Messages
3,975
Location
east of the Exe and west of the Axe
I am new to this place but after a long time of watching City and reading this forum I have finally felt the urge to join.

There are so many things wrong with this club at the moment and whilst I appreciate the “join the Trust Board and do something about it” comments, not everyone can do this and certainly if you do not have any faith in the Trust model as I don’t then this is not an option. My main gripes are:

1. “We are no ordinary club” mantra that keeps getting trotted out. Well I for one did not ask for an abnormal club to support. I just want to be able to go and watch my football club play football with some interest and passion again as was always the case until the last 5 years or so. I am not interested in the 3g pitches, community work, fair play awards etc. I just want to see 11 players in their correct positions giving it their all and playing with freedom in a positive manner. Why do we feel the need to go to Brazil? Why is winning a football match not the ultimate aim? Why can’t we be an ordinary football club?!
2. Paul Tisdale. I am not going to waste time repeating what many others on here and Social Media are already saying but the man is a disgrace. He represents everything that is wrong with this club and the director it is going in. It is well known that is he the highest paid manager in this league which I would have less problem with if he did not constantly bleat about “lack of funds”. If we are that short then scrap your £125k salary and put it in the budget! Here is a radical idea, get 2 players in each position who do not have a history of injuries and are not over 35, play simple football and see what happens. You may be surprised! His attitude towards the fan base is pure contempt andhow he gets away with it is beyond me.
3. Steve Perryman. What is his role? Does he still get paid a ridiculous figure (used to be circa £80k) to do absolutely nothing? His time at the club must come to an end unless he is a non-paid ambassador of some sorts.
4. Julian Tagg. What else can be said about this man? His ramblings in the press are an embarrassment and his blind faith in Paul Tisdale is beyond comprehension. The sooner he goes or realises that we are meant to be professional football club rather than a sporting academy the better.
5. The supporters. Probably the biggest culprits of all in my opinion. The fact that I am still reading “it’s early in the season, give Tisdale 10 games…” is unbelievable. This is not a flash in the pan bad start or something new. It is 5 years of unacceptable home form and excuses now. How can anyone honestly believe Tisdale is still the best man for the job? The unambitious lethargic attitude of our supporters is the most shameful thing in all of this. “We have always been rubbish, we are at our level” drives me mad. Is football not about hope and dreams? Should I not be able to think one day Exeter City could be an established Championship team or even do a Blackpool, Hull, Swansea, Burnley, Fulham, Wigan etc and have a spell in the top flight? I know all of the aforementioned clubs had money injected but if someone did ever approach us to invest I honestly do not think we would ever know about it and they would be quietly pushed away in order to protect the tripartite farce of Tisdale, Perryman & Tagg.

I am glad I got that off my chest, after all that is what forums are for I believe.
Is pretty much the 101% complete answer.
 
Joined
Sep 21, 2014
Messages
534
Location
Exeter
The future direction of the club is a matter for shareholders: they should not abdicate that responsibility or accept that the future can be determined by any club employee. Right now, there seems to be confusion over whether the priority is developing talent or winning games. Both have merit and both could probably co-exist but there has to be clarity. And that requires a very clear plan to be communicated to the staff, the shareholders and all the other stakeholders. The content of that plan must reflect the preferences of shareholders and that means that each Trust member should contribute; they have paid for that privilege. It would be helpful if the executive were supportive of the plan: if not, it can simply be passed by resolution at an AGM/EGM. The executives would then be entrusted with its delivery and liable to termination if they were unwilling or unable.

Having some money in the bank – and there must be plenty left – is not a reason for continuing to run the business poorly. And trusting the use of that cash to some of the very folk who directed the club to the precipice of insolvency is a brave move. Of course, it is possible that Messrs Mason and Lee have knocked some sense into Tagg but I would suggest the Trust seeks to protect its investment in a more robust manner.

In my view, the Club Board should be no more complicated than a CEO and Finance Director and two non-executives; one should be appointed by the Trust, the other should be independent of the Trust and Club. The first two positions would be salaried club employees whilst the Trust and Club should cover the fees for the two non-execs respectively. The non execs have to be paid: you are never certain to attract the best candidates if you favour volunteer contributions.

The Trust Board shouldn’t be that complicated either. Find a Chairman (pay them) who will act as a figurehead – Ade Edmondson would be a decent choice – in order to sell the ‘we own our club’ concept to the widest possible community. If Edmondson is too busy/not interested, at the very least find somebody who is engaging and doesn’t act like a ***** every time they make a public comment. And create a very real distinction in the minds of the public between the Trust and the Club. It should be a compelling story which is somewhat unique and easily told. The Trust should also appoint somebody (on a part-time salary) who can leverage the goodwill generated by the Chairman to bolster Trust income via increased membership especially amongst local businesses. The right person would pay for themselves several times over: it shouldn’t be too tricky to increase annual Trust revenues to £200k even if the only product on offer is membership.

After that, you can have as many Trust sub-committees as you like because you have a) taken better care of your investment by improving the oversight on the board and b) protected/enhanced your own Trust revenues. These sub-committees can be manned by enthusiastic volunteers who can all focus on their particular area of interest. It would be helpful if they could embrace the talents of the wider membership too so there is a real sense of a communal effort. The regular Trust board meetings can collate the views which need to be communicated to the non-exec representing the Trust. Right now, the effort is so dismal and the interest is so lacking that the Trust either didn’t meet in July (as scheduled) or didn’t think it was necessary to post the minutes.

Oh, and I have no idea whether Tagg is CEO or Chairman nowadays. He is reported in the media as being the Chairman but I suspect he is also the CEO (after the ludicrous decision to mess around with the woefully inadequate GW). That said, I do know that the UK Corporate Governance Code frowns on a) anybody holding the two positions simultaneously or b) a CEO being elevated to Chairman (and thereby potentially impacting the performance of any new CEO). The Trust has failed miserably if they have allowed Tagg to perform both roles: it wouldn’t be a smart idea even if he was outstanding.
This is well constructed and thought through. Trouble is Tagg is far too over bearing , wont listen to outside advice and in many environments some might accuse of him of having a bullying style. He seems to have Stalinist zeal for getting rid of people who offer advice which he doesn't agree with. The reason football matters are not discussed in meetings is that he doesnt allow them to be discussed apparently. This seems like madness as Tis is the highest paid employee across the enterprise. Perryman probably the second highest and the Executive Director Football probably the 3rd ( can anyone see a pattern emerging????). The club sits bottom of the table after years and years of poor performance yet no one is held to account!
 

Sexton Blake

Well-known Exeweb poster
Joined
Dec 16, 2011
Messages
8,872
The future direction of the club is a matter for shareholders: they should not abdicate that responsibility or accept that the future can be determined by any club employee. Right now, there seems to be confusion over whether the priority is developing talent or winning games. Both have merit and both could probably co-exist but there has to be clarity. And that requires a very clear plan to be communicated to the staff, the shareholders and all the other stakeholders. The content of that plan must reflect the preferences of shareholders and that means that each Trust member should contribute; they have paid for that privilege. It would be helpful if the executive were supportive of the plan: if not, it can simply be passed by resolution at an AGM/EGM. The executives would then be entrusted with its delivery and liable to termination if they were unwilling or unable.

Having some money in the bank – and there must be plenty left – is not a reason for continuing to run the business poorly. And trusting the use of that cash to some of the very folk who directed the club to the precipice of insolvency is a brave move. Of course, it is possible that Messrs Mason and Lee have knocked some sense into Tagg but I would suggest the Trust seeks to protect its investment in a more robust manner.

In my view, the Club Board should be no more complicated than a CEO and Finance Director and two non-executives; one should be appointed by the Trust, the other should be independent of the Trust and Club. The first two positions would be salaried club employees whilst the Trust and Club should cover the fees for the two non-execs respectively. The non execs have to be paid: you are never certain to attract the best candidates if you favour volunteer contributions.

The Trust Board shouldn’t be that complicated either. Find a Chairman (pay them) who will act as a figurehead – Ade Edmondson would be a decent choice – in order to sell the ‘we own our club’ concept to the widest possible community. If Edmondson is too busy/not interested, at the very least find somebody who is engaging and doesn’t act like a ***** every time they make a public comment. And create a very real distinction in the minds of the public between the Trust and the Club. It should be a compelling story which is somewhat unique and easily told. The Trust should also appoint somebody (on a part-time salary) who can leverage the goodwill generated by the Chairman to bolster Trust income via increased membership especially amongst local businesses. The right person would pay for themselves several times over: it shouldn’t be too tricky to increase annual Trust revenues to £200k even if the only product on offer is membership.

After that, you can have as many Trust sub-committees as you like because you have a) taken better care of your investment by improving the oversight on the board and b) protected/enhanced your own Trust revenues. These sub-committees can be manned by enthusiastic volunteers who can all focus on their particular area of interest. It would be helpful if they could embrace the talents of the wider membership too so there is a real sense of a communal effort. The regular Trust board meetings can collate the views which need to be communicated to the non-exec representing the Trust. Right now, the effort is so dismal and the interest is so lacking that the Trust either didn’t meet in July (as scheduled) or didn’t think it was necessary to post the minutes.

Oh, and I have no idea whether Tagg is CEO or Chairman nowadays. He is reported in the media as being the Chairman but I suspect he is also the CEO (after the ludicrous decision to mess around with the woefully inadequate GW). That said, I do know that the UK Corporate Governance Code frowns on a) anybody holding the two positions simultaneously or b) a CEO being elevated to Chairman (and thereby potentially impacting the performance of any new CEO). The Trust has failed miserably if they have allowed Tagg to perform both roles: it wouldn’t be a smart idea even if he was outstanding.
One of the best and most constructive posts on this particular subject yet. Needs to be actioned and not just left to lie on stony ground.
 

globegrecian

Well-known Exeweb poster
Joined
Jun 22, 2007
Messages
6,313
Location
Disbelief...
Yes.................
 
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