Politics Today

[IndoMike]

As an aside, not being part of Schengen means we lose a helluva lot of tourists. Many from Asia do the Western Europe tour but miss out the UK.

 

[spanky]

As an aside, not being part of Schengen means we lose a helluva lot of tourists. Many from Asia do the Western Europe tour but miss out the UK.

Putting my "reasonable" hat back on, and removing my "ranting, got the flu, woken by the daughter at 3.30, angry" hat...

I'm sure Mike, but if it weren't for the checking of criminal movements, or illnesses (such as rabies), etc, we'd have adopted Schengen. As an island nation it makes no sense, as proven by Ireland also opting out.

 

[IndoMike]

Putting my "reasonable" hat back on, and removing my "ranting, got the flu, woken by the daughter at 3.30, angry" hat...

I'm sure Mike, but if it weren't for the checking of criminal movements, or illnesses (such as rabies), etc, we'd have adopted Schengen. As an island nation it makes no sense, as proven by Ireland also opting out.

Yes, you came out of your corner fighting this morning (your time).
I'm not sure that I agree with you, Spanky, or maybe I don't get your point.
Seems to me that if it's OK for EU countries in general to have no problem with offering Schengen I don't see why it should be a problem for us.
I do agree that the reasons you give might be the considerations, but imo these are problems that every country by as to deal with, regardless.

 

[IndoMike]

Putting my "reasonable" hat back on, and removing my "ranting, got the flu, woken by the daughter at 3.30, angry" hat...

I'm sure Mike, but if it weren't for the checking of criminal movements, or illnesses (such as rabies), etc, we'd have adopted Schengen. As an island nation it makes no sense, as proven by Ireland also opting out.

H

Hope your flu gets better soon

 

[IndoMike]

G2K in post 6,916 was laying into the Brexit supporting press for over colourful language which he saw as not part of reasonable debate. I take it that you regard the words on the poster as conducive to reasonable debate ?

Alistair :
The people were offered the opportunity to decide on our membership but without knowing the terms and conditions. Nobody would normally agree or even disagree with a proposition without knowing the T&C.

The problem was the referendum was rushed into and lacked details. Due to the nature of the campaigning it became an emotional rather than an educated choice -on both sides.

After 3 long years of debate and argument the public is better prepared to make the choice. If the last referendum was badly flawed we should be brave enough to say it.

If another referendum is held - confirmatory - then who knows : maybe the BREXIT vote will increase - a result which I and I suspect many Leavers would be bound to accept without question.

I think this is totally reasonable, and the obvious question is, what are Leavers afraid of?

I would add one more thing : it's true that there might still be no clear majority after a 2nd referendum, but it's also true that there might be no clear majority after a GE, which many Brexiters are also requesting.

If the country remains totally split more or less down the middle then we're in a spot of bother

 

[Mr Jinx]

Like have a referendum to shut up your backbenches and shoot the Farage fox .

Ah, another attempt to shoot the Farage fox. Because the last X attempts have all gone according to plan!

On another note, talk today that Bercow may attempt to block any vote on Boris's new WA. Go on pal, I dare you!

 

[Mr Jinx]

Err, well apart (most recently) in Switzerland in April 2019? Most ironically because "the voters hadn't been sufficiently informed"!!!

Switzerland has Referendums like monthly. You can't use them as a comparison.

 

[tavyred]

The only thing that can unite the country after time is leaving the EU. If it’s a disaster, we’ll no doubt opt to go back in after a few short years, as a result people like me will have to suck it up and concede that we got it wrong. If its a success or benign in its effects maybe it’ll kill the argument for EU membership stone dead and we’ll move on as a nation, although I’m there sure will still be people advocating EU membership just as there were people wobbling on about leaving the EEC/EU when we were members.
A 2nd referendum does nothing to ‘heal the nation’ whatever the result.

 

[elginCity]

Switzerland has Referendums like monthly. You can't use them as a comparison.

Why ever not ? The referendum principle that voters should be given accurate and full information, not misinformation, applies however many referendums a nation might run. Another referendum principle is campaigning should be lawful, Vote Leave broke the law, a fact it’s accepted.

The EU referendum in 2016 should be declared null and void.

Continuing to defend the indefensible, justifying the illicit means of a result only because the outcome is one you wanted is not democratic.

It is cultist and zealotry, I’m actually embarrassed for you Brexiters.

 

[DB9]

The only thing that can unite the country after time is leaving the EU. If it’s a disaster, we’ll no doubt opt to go back in after a few short years, as a result people like me will have to suck it up and concede that we got it wrong. If its a success or benign in its effects maybe it’ll kill the argument for EU membership stone dead and we’ll move on as a nation, although I’m there sure will still be people advocating EU membership just as there were people wobbling on about leaving the EEC/EU when we were members.
A 2nd referendum does nothing to ‘heal the nation’ whatever the result.

Leaving won't unite the country nor will a 2nd ref. I have no idea what will but there is a lot of bad blood at the moment and leaving won't solve that