General Election - 8thJune

[arthur]

No point in blinking if there is no one in front of you. Once we actually leave then and only then will the EU come calling.
At this moment they are laughing their heads off at us ..... Look at ze stupid Englander tommies ze people zay achtung leave but ze swinehund gestapo leaders say nine you will not leave until ve zay zo.

For goodness sake - can't you step outside this fantasy world you live in, just for once? The British have made such tits of themselves with their cocktail of "cake and eat it" arrogance and institutional stupidity that no-one is going to come calling anytime soon. Just what is the basis for your assertion? "They need us more than we need them" is a slogan beloved by people of your ilk with not a jot of evidence to back it up.

It all comes from this tired old worldview beloved of certain males of your age. "We beat the Germans in two world wars and now they're bossing us about". Closely related to "The last time we were in Europe we were liberating it". Yes, Britain stood alone and vanquished the wicked Germans - the Soviet Union and the United States were merely bit part players whom we graciously allowed to share in our glory.

You don't hear this crap from people who actually fought in war. You didn't hear it from politicians like Edward Heath and Denis Healey who actually saw action and put their lives on the line, in contrast with the pygmies we have today (yes you, Gavin Williamson) and their cheerleaders such as you. And you don't hear it from the many EU countries who were actually occupied and terrorized by the Nazis 80 years ago. So why this obsession by men your age with the war and the idea that Britain is somehow exceptional and different? Isn't it time you moved on from your childhood and embraced the world as it is, not as it actually never was?

 

[IndoMike]

The people of Britain were strong and brave during the 2nd World War and so were our armed forces. But we have to accept that having the English Channel between us and mainland Europe didn't half help. Difficult to overrun the sea with tanks.

 

[Temporarily Exiled]

No point in blinking if there is no one in front of you. Once we actually leave then and only then will the EU come calling.

Believe it or not, the EU has actually had the foresight to see this move coming. It prompted the following response:
EU says it would not open talks with UK after no-deal Brexit until it agrees to divorce bill and Irish backstop − The Independent

“The UK will be more affected than the EU because a managed or negotiated no-deal does not exist, any more so than a transition period for a no-deal,” Mr Juncker told MEPs.

“Whatever happens the UK will have to respond to the three main questions of the separation: one, citizens’ rights, they must be respected and protected. Two, the UK will have to continue to honour its financial commitments taken as a member state. And three, a solution will have to be found for the island of Ireland, preserving peace and the single market.

“The UK must respect the spirit and the letter of the Good Friday Agreement. No withdrawal agreement does not mean no commitment and the three questions that I have just mentioned will not disappear overnight: they will constitute strict conditions for rebuilding trust and launching discussions on the future.”

Obviously 3 years is not long enough for our politicians, As for food hoarding, Blame the internet and people who believe too much of what they see online

Might've been long enough if they'd actually agreed on a negotiating position more than 6 months before the deadline.

 

[Jason H]

Yes, interesting indeed. D Raab - someone who has risen without trace. He is a bit like Brexit - there are perceived plus points but no-one can identify them.

The MPs will only give you a choice of two. Who do you think they'll be?

Raab has been busy establishing his small c conservative credentials of late - small state, pro-business, less interference in everyday lives, that sort of thing. Plus he comes across as a human being, which is nice. He has been gathering significant grassroots support amongst the membership.

Hard to say who will be the final two if I'm honest. As is often the case here MPs from the various factions may need to unite somewhat to get a suitable candidate over the line - especially the "Anyone But Boris" brigade. Boris could probably count on the votes of some of the Baker/JRM/Francois axis but not many others. I don't think anyone from the heavy remain side of the party (Amber Rudd being the main candidate from that faction) will stand a chance.

So in essence it comes down to whoever the moderate remainers and moderate brexiteers put up. Might end up being something like Jeremy Hunt vs either Gove or Raab, and it will likely depend on which big hitters they attract as backers - members may end up voting based on who that they like is in which camp e.g. Mordaunt, Javid etc.

I'm glad to see Rory Stewart has put his head above the parapet, but I remain convinced he won't make it to the final ballot.

 

[Banksy]

The Tory leadership contest is a poisoned chalice. Whatever clown wins it has still got to get past the remaining three quarters odd of the British public who won’t want him or her anyway regardless of what the Tory faithful think.
The thought of Boris or Gove makes me shudder.....

 

[Temporarily Exiled]

I think Baker will run. If he runs, he has a good chance of winning.

 

[arthur]

I'm glad to see Rory Stewart has put his head above the parapet, but I remain convinced he won't make it to the final ballot.

So am I. An interesting and thoughtful man who writes good books. I'm not sure that these count as plusses in the current Conservative Party

 

[Jason H]

I think Baker will run. If he runs, he has a good chance of winning.

He really doesn't.

 

[Temporarily Exiled]

He really doesn't.

Depends how candidates fall in the early rounds. I could quite easily see him as getting the backing of a lot of the ERG, many of whom don't actually like Boris. Raab would be the biggest threat, but if Raab polled lower than Baker in round 1 (possible) then that bloc of voters could quite comfortably fall behind Baker.

So am I. An interesting and thoughtful man who writes good books. I'm not sure that these count as plusses in the current Conservative Party

Also quite loose with figures and statistics (to put it nicely).

 

[DB9]

Corbyn bins talks with Tories, Seems sensible to me, May hasn't moved her "Red Lines" talks were going nowhere and when she leaves any agreement they might have made could have been ripped up when the new Tory Leader is in place, Wasted exercise on both parties