Politics Today

[arthur]

I do remember their opposition to the GFA, Was it Mo Mowlan (RIP) who managed finally to get them to agree? NI needs to thrive otherwise it could get tricky again overe there.

In 1970 I worked with for a working class protestant who had come to live in England. The troubles were a year or two old, but the worst of the horrors were still to happen. "What you English don't understand" he said "are the sort of people you're dealing with. You have reasonable people like Willie Whitelaw thinking they'll go and have reasonable conversations with Unionist politicians and everything will get sorted out. He will get a nasty surprise"

 

[DB9]

In 1970 I worked with for a working class protestant who had come to live in England. The troubles were a year or two old, but the worst of the horrors were still to happen. "What you English don't understand" he said "are the sort of people you're dealing with. You have reasonable people like Willie Whitelaw thinking they'll go and have reasonable conversations with Unionist politicians and everything will get sorted out. He will get a nasty surprise"

Those views back then were really entrenched on both sides, Yet once the GFA was up and running you had two polar opposites, Paisley and McGuiness ending up working together and becoming good friends.

 

[Mr Jinx]

Because he liked Corbyn and thought that the Labour Party would unequivocally support Brexit. Both serious errors of judgement. The fact is that Labour's strong performance in 2017 was largely due to the bulk of the Remainer vote going to Labour. The Party then found itself in a similar position to the Tories now - a broad coalition of people voting for it with little in common to bind them together

Fairly accurate account that. There was something I liked about Jezza. I'm not a died in the wool Tory...far from it in fact. I voted Labour up until I was past my mid thirties. And I think I've voted more for Farage than I have Conservative in my time. Couldn't stand Theresa May me.

Yes, and with regards to me believing that Labour would unequivocally support Brexit...fool me once, shame on you...and all that. That's why I'd never ever trust a Labour/LD/SNP PM with Brexit.

I found Lammy's latest statement on Brexit to be little more than weasel words trying to fool the public (again).

 

[arthur]

Those views back then were really entrenched on both sides, Yet once the GFA was up and running you had two polar opposites, Paisley and McGuiness ending up working together and becoming good friends.

The problem with "on both sides" (implying that they're as bad as eachother) is that it ignores the entrenched imbalance of power.

Protestant power was absolute in those days and the British government paid no attention "John Bull's political slum". Discrimination against Catholics was institutiononalised, particularly in jobs, housing and voting rights.

In 1969/70 senior army officers, who in my experience are always worth listening to, said that a political solution was essential if the successes they'd achieved in stopping people being burnt out of their homes was to be sustained.

It took nearly 30 more years to find one. And this settlement still hasn't been accepted by a significant minority of the population. The question is how much longer are they going to be appeased....

 

[DB9]

The problem with "on both sides" (implying that they're as bad as eachother) is that it ignores the entrenched imbalance of power.

Protestant power was absolute in those days and the British government paid no attention "John Bull's political slum". Discrimination against Catholics was institutiononalised, particularly in jobs, housing and voting rights.

In 1969/70 senior army officers, who in my experience are always worth listening to, said that a political solution was essential if the successes they'd achieved in stopping people being burnt out of their homes was to be sustained.

It took nearly 30 more years to find one. And this settlement still hasn't been accepted by a significant minority of the population. The question is how much longer are they going to be appeased....

Agree totally, The early days of "The Troubles" were because the Catholic or Nationalist side were being treated as 2nd class citizens because the Unionist side ruled everything and the army was sent in to protect the Catholics, Unfortunately the biggest recruitment for the IRA at that time was internment as told by the brilliant journalist Peter Taylor.

 

[Mr Jinx]

Thanks, From you I'll take that as a compliment.

So thousands of UK residents never left these shores to start a new life in the EU? Funny isn't it, We had the lies about EU migrants "Taking our jobs" etc and now we have a skills/worker shortage

Yes, but I though we were talking about control (of numbers) or, more to the point, the lack of it.

It's one thing saying your lot can come here as long as our lot can come there. It's wholly another to caveat that with limits.

There were never any limits with EU countries, and so open the doors between here and say Romania, guess what is going to happen? And funnily enough, it did. Pretty much one way traffic...in large numbers.

 

[Mr Jinx]

But net migration has increased since Brexit - it‘s just that more of those arriving on these shores are coming from outside the UK. Notwithstanding I’m reasonably sure this wasn’t what the Leavers told us to expect, perhaps you could explain how this situation benefits the UK?!

How can you say that when they quite clearly never knew how many came here in the first place?:

UK immigration numbers from EU underestimated by 1.6 million

UK immigration numbers from the EU have been seriously underestimated, according to new findings. Full story, here.

workpermit.com

And you have to ask, how would they have known exactly, with barely any controls in place?

 

[IndoMike]

The Boris Johnson File - video.

 

[IndoMike]

What a toer Johnson is...Sad fecker.

 

[angelic upstart]

How can you say that when they quite clearly never knew how many came here in the first place?

Just goes to show how badly the country is run. If someone moves to the UK, and gets a job, they get an NI number. If they weren't provided it when they were 15/16. At this point, you either get a job or claim benefits, both of which need a NI number.

I totally understand that a small percentage of EU residents will be living off grid and not claiming or paying tax, whilst working cash in hand etc. But I struggle to believe it would be the best part of a million in 8 years.

How can you not know. I think they did/do know but massage the figures.