Politics Today

[DB9]

Our council discusses a lot of things, the most of which never get done.

Totally agree they do, Still not a reason for a mob to unilaterally pull down a statue. I'd like to think that with this new proposed law there will be some mechanism for people to say to councils that a statue is offensive for perhaps being a former slave owner etc and if enough people say this a council can debate it, Just like they do in parliament when you get so many signatures on an online petition. You can't let mob rule decide.

 

[IndoMike]

Totally agree they do, Still not a reason for a mob to unilaterally pull down a statue. I'd like to think that with this new proposed law there will be some mechanism for people to say to councils that a statue is offensive for perhaps being a former slave owner etc and if enough people say this a council can debate it, Just like they do in parliament when you get so many signatures on an online petition. You can't let mob rule decide.

Regarding the statues, surely the best place for them is in a museum. That's what museums are for, isn't it : safeguarding historical artefacts with information to educate the visitors on what they represent. Times change and in retrospect opinions and values change. I doubt if for example the people of Bristol had much say in the matter when it was erected.
The fact is that some of these blokes made their money off the backs of the slave trade. Maybe acceptable then but not any more. To the museum!

 

[DB9]

Regarding the statues, surely the best place for them is in a museum. That's what museums are for, isn't it : safeguarding historical artefacts with information to educate the visitors on what they represent. Times change and in retrospect opinions and values change. I doubt if for example the people of Bristol had much say in the matter when it was erected.
The fact is that some of these blokes made their money off the backs of the slave trade. Maybe acceptable then but not any more. To the museum!

I agree if that's what's decided lawfully, Not torn down by a mob.

 

[IndoMike]

I agree if that's what's decided lawfully, Not torn down by a mob.

Yes. Difficult to justify vandalism.
I wish they could do something about all the graffiti sprayed all over the place, too. If it's at a specially designated place, that's fine. But otherwise it looks ugly.

 

[Hermann]

So bored of this "it's censoring the past" argument. It's not. Books still exist. Museums still exist. Unless they're proposing to add a plague to every statue saying "was also a massive racist" then that's censoring the past.

Anyway, the government doesn't give a carp about statues. It reckons the "culture war" is the new brexit, so get ready to enjoy 4 years of being bored by that.

 

[lamrobhero]

As I have said before "identity politics" is the preserve of the right-wing but as is a common tatic they accuse the left-wing of what they themselves are doing.

 

[tavyred]

As I have said before "identity politics" is the preserve of the right-wing but as is a common tatic they accuse the left-wing of what they themselves are doing.

That’s patently not true, it is however the preserve of the extreme fringes of both left and right.
The issue in the U.K. of late is that a mainstream party in Labour is unhealthily obsessed with it and the Tories are happily making political capital as a result.

 

[lamrobhero]

That’s patently not true, it is however the preserve of the extreme fringes of both left and right.
The issue in the U.K. of late is that a mainstream party in Labour is unhealthily obsessed with it and the Tories are happily making political capital as a result.

Identity politics is characterised by the following:

• The idea that cultural identity is NOT a free choice by an individual
• That there is only ONE truth of cultural identity
• That the role of politics is to reinforce and validate this ONE truth

Mr Jenrick demonstrates all of these characteristics is he an extremist?
Is David "We are a Christian country" Cameron an extremist?

I would be interested to hear of any left-wingers who have the above characteristics.

 

[Mr Jinx]

Totally agree they do, Still not a reason for a mob to unilaterally pull down a statue. I'd like to think that with this new proposed law there will be some mechanism for people to say to councils that a statue is offensive for perhaps being a former slave owner etc and if enough people say this a council can debate it, Just like they do in parliament when you get so many signatures on an online petition. You can't let mob rule decide.

Yes, that was my point. Just because Bristol council were discussing it, it doesn't mean a mob can then assume it's going anyway and then go and do it themselves.

I've no doubt that the Bristol Council as part of their discussions would've met enough local resistance to think better of removing it. Too late now though.

 

[tavyred]

Identity politics is characterised by the following:

• The idea that cultural identity is NOT a free choice by an individual
• That there is only ONE truth of cultural identity
• That the role of politics is to reinforce and validate this ONE truth

Mr Jenrick demonstrates all of these characteristics is he an extremist?
Is David "We are a Christian country" Cameron an extremist?

I would be interested to hear of any left-wingers who have the above characteristics.

I’m not sure that’s a definition of identity politics I’d recognise.
Thanks to google I think is more accurate definition, if only because it can be applied to all political persuasions and not just to right wingers as you are bizarrely suggesting.

“Identity politics is a phrase that is widely used to describe the deployment of the category of identity as a tool to frame political claims, promote political ideologies, or stimulate and orientate social and political action....”