Politics Today

[angelic upstart]

All makes sense to me but again I come back to the 1970s comparison - at the time the economy was dire, the country in deep decline and the future looking very bleak. The politicians of the day could have gone with the 'blame immigrants' approach but they strived, and succeeded, to not succumb to that temptation. In contrast now the new generation of 'populist' right-wing politicians do not have that moral compass - instead they dive into the cesspit of public opinion to claw out every last vote they can grab.

The two party system has no ideas left, they haven't for years. Nothing they've done has worked and everything has been sold to foreign interests and doesn't work properly. They have no option but to be populist or pander to the marginal groups. Cos it's so much simpler than finding a few quid for some coppers and a couple of prisons.

 

[lamrobhero]

All makes sense to me but again I come back to the 1970s comparison - at the time the economy was dire, the country in deep decline and the future looking very bleak. The politicians of the day could have gone with the 'blame immigrants' approach but they strived, and succeeded, to not succumb to that temptation. In contrast now the new generation of 'populist' right-wing politicians do not have that moral compass - instead they dive into the cesspit of public opinion to claw out every last vote they can grab.

In the 1970s there was something called socialism. There was hope. Now politicians dare not mention the E-word.

 

[Phil Sayers]

In the 1970s there was something called socialism. There was hope. Now politicians dare not mention the E-word.

No doubt socialism was a much bigger 'beacon' back then but my point is that the senior Conservative politicians of the day were willing to endorse and vote for socially progressive policies (comparative to the opinions of the electorate) even though they knew those positions were unpopular and would lose them votes to the National Front. Now such scruples are rapidly disappearing and being replaced with simply 'get every vote you can no matter how low you need to sink to get it'.

 

[Alistair20000]

In the 1970s there was something called socialism. There was hope. Now politicians dare not mention the E-word.

The socialist policies of the 1974/79 Labour government were an economic disaster. I don’t call that hope,

 

[arthur]

The socialist policies of the 1974/79 Labour government were an economic disaster. I don’t call that hope,

And what socialist policies might they have been? All I recall is a government with no majority struggling to stay in power and grappling with the Union barons on one side, the IMF on another and the Scottish Nationalists on another. Not much time or space for socialism, of any variety. Too busy dealing with consequences of the Barber boom!

 

[lamrobhero]

No doubt socialism was a much bigger 'beacon' back then but my point is that the senior Conservative politicians of the day were willing to endorse and vote for socially progressive policies (comparative to the opinions of the electorate) even though they knew those positions were unpopular and would lose them votes to the National Front. Now such scruples are rapidly disappearing and being replaced with simply 'get every vote you can no matter how low you need to sink to get it'.

My point is that if you do not have real hope you might embrace false hope.
Mr Heath fought in the 2nd World War.
Mrs Thatcher went into the 1979 general election saying "some people feel that their culture is being threatened."

 

[Alistair20000]

And what socialist policies might they have been? All I recall is a government with no majority struggling to stay in power and grappling with the Union barons on one side, the IMF on another and the Scottish Nationalists on another. Not much time or space for socialism, of any variety. Too busy dealing with consequences of the Barber boom!

Oh dear.

Apologies and excuses for gross failure will not wash on this one art. Why did they not stand up to union barons ? The opposition would not have voted that down.

Ludicrous personal and business tax rates, inflation at 26% not all attributable to the Barber boom, surrender to trade unions, catastrophic interventionist policies that just kept zombie industries alive, humiliating application for a bale out to the IMF.

Some credit to James Callaghan later on in that ministry for embracing economic realism.

 

[lamrobhero]

My point is that if you do not have real hope you might embrace false hope.
Mr Heath fought in the 2nd World War.
Mrs Thatcher went into the 1979 general election saying "some people feel that their culture is being threatened."

Having just looked it up Mrs Thatcher said "swamped" not "threatened".
The 1970s marked the transition to floating exchange rates and the abolition of capital controls, countries became beholden to the international money markets - which is why joining the Euro would have been good as it gives some insularity from those forces.

 

[tavyred]

All makes sense to me but again I come back to the 1970s comparison - at the time the economy was dire, the country in deep decline and the future looking very bleak. The politicians of the day could have gone with the 'blame immigrants' approach but they strived, and succeeded, to not succumb to that temptation. In contrast now the new generation of 'populist' right-wing politicians do not have that moral compass - instead they dive into the cesspit of public opinion to claw out every last vote they can grab.

Is every negative opinion on the policy of large scale inward migration of the “cesspit” variety?
Forgive me Phil, but you seem heavy on comment about the symptoms of this issue, less interested in the causes.

 

[BigBanker]

Fair play - he did say shades of right. And the broader point I was making was that, in general, the Labour Party was pitching itself further right than it needed to, trying to appeal to people who were never going to vote for it anyway. And, in so doing, alienating people who once made up its core vote. A bit like the Tories, come to think of it...

Yes but Labour shifting towards the moderate right is just a move towards the centre. The Tories appeasing their loony far right is a very different beast and more akin to the dark days of Corbyn's Labour.