GENERAL ELECTION 2019

[elginCity]

European Unity in this case is following Macon’s lead and pivoting toward Putin’s Russia who he deems is a lesser risk. Much rather the flexibility to follow our own chosen path and pivoting away from countries like Russia, who bring chemical weapons to Southern England.

Rapprochement attempts by one sole member state (of the 27) with uniquely strong historical links to Russia is hardly a threat to European peace and security !

 

[elginCity]

Although the EU trade negotiator at the WTO will be Irish, no doubt he’ll be under instruction to protect Germany’s ability to flog circa 20% of its car output to us Brits.

Here we go again, the German car makers lobby argument. Tavvers, you forgot to add “they need us more than we need them”

 

[Alistair20000]

Good reasoning G2k, though I tend towards Kier Starmer. Another good longshot for me would be David Milliband (untainted by the Brexit mess). The union votes that put his brother in charge marks the begining of the party's slide to it's current low. How differently things might have worked out had the adenoid king not stolen David's crown. However, momentum will be pushing a very different agenda.
Of course Milliband would first need to rejoin politics and win himself a seat. Would he want to do that? Unfinished business might tempt him.

Hard to leave the HOC for any lengthy time and come back. Remember Portillo ? He admitted he did not really have the heart for it when he came back. Added to which Labour has a mountain to climb to win a majority in 2024. They may need to elect a leader who knows they are 10 years off power and that length of time in opposition is a daunting prospect.

 

[DB9]

I will stick my head above the electoral parapet as someone who is (still) a firm labour supporter despite the current debacle.

No one can deny it has been an agonizing reverse. Especially as, for someone with fundamentally socialist views it has allowed a relatively right-wing Tory clique relatively unfettered power for the next five years. Fair enough - it is the indisputable will of (43.6% of) the voting electorate.

But, psephology and electoral quirks apart it is what it is. So where now?

One thing I have always believed is that, without a strong opposition the result is bad and unaccountable governance. This has been true, in recent decades, of both parties. Both with Thatcher in the 80s and Blair in the 2000s unfettered power fostered a decade or more of increasingly dubious administrations. Solely because the losing parties on each occasion were too focused on their own navel gazing and in-fighting to even bother to hold the respective Tory and Labour rulers to any form of proper account.

I do fear that, especially with the real "leg work" of Brexit now on the agenda - and a plethora of dubious manifesto "pledges" now on the table, the task of proper and effective scrutiny needs to start right from day 1. Something that, I fear, JC's emollient words about "time for reflection" in my party will do little to address.

Hence my own (admittedly extremely) radical suggestion that the current leader SHOULD stand down immediately and, pending ultimate choice of a long term leader (and hopefully future PM) to lead us into 2024 and beyond an interim leader should be appointed, not only to oversee the full and fair process to select the successor but also (and, arguably, even more importantly) face a euphoric and over-confident government in Parliament.

So (takes a deep breath here...) I would actually recommend MARGARET HODGE for such an interim post.

1) She is has a long standing record as an effective and fair-minded parliamentarian, but also a true and strong voice for the moderate Labour left.

2) Everything from her history, especially as head of committees, would point to the fact that she seems well respected, even by her opponents.

3) She speaks her mind well - I suspect "blustering BoJo" would not relish facing her at PMQs.

4) It cannot surely be suggested that her appointment at the head of the party, and active involvement in resolution, could do anything other that rest the bogie of "Antisemitism & cover ups" that was so effectively mobilised in this campaign.

5) She would, absolutely certainly, be only an interim hand to steady the ship in the short term, but also to lead effective opposition and begin to direct new policy as well.

I wonder how our "right leaning" friends here might view such a move!

Fine summerising there G2K, I'm not having this "Time for Reflection" with Corbyn in charge he needs to go now and i did say earlier an interim leader appointed while a new, permenant one is sorted. MH would be a good start, She has the respect of a wide range of people and will "Steady the ship" too because let's face it the HOC will not be a happy place for Labour for a long while and no one will take Corbyn seriously at all while he's still "LINO" Long term I'd loved David Milliband there but that ship has sailed, I still think someone should try and persuade Dan Jarvis to put his hat into the ring. If Labour vote in another far left wing leader then don't expect Government for a generation, That side of the party needs to be totally side lined like Kinnock did in the 80's. As for policies Labour needs to get rid of this "Rich people are all nasty" I was castigated on here for saying Corbyn was preaching "Politics of Envy" but its true while we need a party with a social feel you need big business on your side to keep creating wealth and jobs, There is a balance out there but to say "150 Billionaires are virtuallly evil" was not fair and just plain wrong and by the way it wasn't the mega rich that got the Tories back in, It was the poor, working class of the North and the Midlands who didn't trust and buy into Corbyns view.

 

[DB9]

24 hours after and still the Labour losers on the leadership side are blaming Brexit alone for their humiliating defeat. You total dumb idiot's Brexit was a big, big factor but Corbyn was the main reason, Scotland didn't vote for Brexit so did they vote for Corbyn even if it meant a good chance of an Indyref2? No they voted SNP, What does that tell you? Corbyn is Toxic, Accept that and move one!!

 

[tavyred]

Here we go again, the German car makers lobby argument. Tavvers, you forgot to add “they need us more than we need them”

We’ll know pretty soon how weak a petitioner the U.K. really is EC.
Even in an entity like the EU there are winners and losers and it’s usually based on the economic and political clout of the individual member state. As the Irish beef farmers recently found out in the EU’s dealings with Trump and the Mercosur nations, the Eurozone automotive sector is seemingly the priority in any EU trade negotiations.
I’m not saying the a U.K. with a newly independent trade policy will slay all before them in any free trade negotiations, I’m just saying our clout will be consistent with us being the 5th/6th biggest economy in the world.

 

[elginCity]

DB9, see Geoff’s post re the Momentum long game.

Corbyn the Lexiter wants time to groom a successor in his own image, not a rejoiner type !

 

[DB9]

DB9, see Geoff’s post re the Momentum long game.

Corbyn the Lexiter wants time to groom a successor in his own image, not a rejoiner type !

I have seen it and I see what Geoff is saying but I'm hoping and have to believe that Labour needs to see this as a wake up call, Left wing don't win elections in the 21st Century

 

[elginCity]

I’m just saying our clout will be consistent with us being the 5th/6th biggest economy in the world.

Success achieved whilst being a full member of the EU. You could at least acknowledge that.

As Merkel warned; a third country on the doorstep is a competitor. The overriding driver will not be Mercedes Benz interests but the protection of the EU27 collective interest, and rightly so.

 

[tavyred]

I have seen it and I see what Geoff is saying but I'm hoping and have to believe that Labour needs to see this as a wake up call........

They won’t.
Blind adherence to political dogma is a defining characteristic of the hard left.