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Politics Today

tavyred

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It's not the borrowing to fund the energy price cap that is the problem, it's her whole approach. (As your mate has pointed out, the energy support package is born out of political expediency rather than any core belief In state intervention)

Black Monday begins...
You literally just posted that the markets aren’t appreciating the projected level of borrowing. 🤷‍♂️
What chance of a hastily arranged MPC meeting to up interest rates?
 

arthur

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You literally just posted that the markets aren’t appreciating the projected level of borrowing. 🤷‍♂️
What chance of a hastily arranged MPC meeting to up interest rates?
No I didn't. I said that the borrowing to fund the price cap is relatively little compared to the massive amount of other borrowing resulting from Fridays " fiscal event".

I agree about the MPC.

So glad to see that you're happier with 2 weeks of Truss than two years of Johnson. The Brexit that the moneyed elite campaigned for (Farage Banks, Odey, Rees Mogg etc.) is finally being got done. I'm sure your left behind "white working class" are delighted with the direction of travel so far
 

tavyred

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No I didn't. I said that the borrowing to fund the price cap is relatively little compared to the massive amount of other borrowing resulting from Fridays " fiscal event".

I agree about the MPC.

So glad to see that you're happier with 2 weeks of Truss than two years of Johnson. The Brexit that the moneyed elite campaigned for (Farage Banks, Odey, Rees Mogg etc.) is finally being got done. I'm sure your left behind "white working class" are delighted with the direction of travel so far
The £120BN per year for two years that we could be borrowing for the energy cap is “relatively little”? You sure?
If (big if) gas prices tumble and wipe out the need for Mad Lizzie’s borrowing for energy binge, part of her big gamble is vindicated.
As I’ve already said, I’m enjoying if nothing else Truss’s clear direction of travel. Early days though.
 

Spanks

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Bit harsh there Art.

Tavy and I have many differences, but I don't recall him ever asking for massive tax breaks for the rich in his Brexit speeches. I genuinely believe its his Brexit that sees the (almost) blind faith in the Tories, because he (and those like him on the fervent Brexit side) cannot see anything but a side back to closer EU alignment should any other party hold power.

And likewise, should Kami Kwarsi economics result in totally tanking the economy, I suspect he'll not be entirely in support.
 

arthur

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Bit harsh there Art.

Tavy and I have many differences, but I don't recall him ever asking for massive tax breaks for the rich in his Brexit speeches.
Nor do I. That's why I was asking whether he was happy with the Truss version of Brexit (deregulation and freedom, including from high taxes, for the moneyed elite), rather than Johnson's which, rhetorically at least, was all about levelling up left behind communities.

I don't consider that particularly harsh
 

arthur

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The £120BN per year for two years that we could be borrowing for the energy cap is “relatively little”? You sure?
If (big if) gas prices tumble and wipe out the need for Mad Lizzie’s borrowing for energy binge, part of her big gamble is vindicated.
Perhaps you should have a word with the financial markets and point this out. Or you could email Susannah Streeter, senior markets analyst at Hargreaves Lansdown

"The worry is that not only will borrowing balloon to eye watering levels, but that the fires of inflation will be fanned further by this tax giveaway, which offers higher earners the bigger tax break."
 

tavyred

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Brexit has happened and just as I was happy to flit from one party to another when we were in the EU, the same will apply now. I still don’t trust Starmer with the Brexit realignment, so I won’t be voting Labour anytime soon is the only caveat I’d make on my first point.
 

tavyred

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Perhaps you should have a word with the financial markets and point this out. Or you could email Susannah Streeter, senior markets analyst at Hargreaves Lansdown

"The worry is that not only will borrowing balloon to eye watering levels, but that the fires of inflation will be fanned further by this tax giveaway, which offers higher earners the bigger tax break."
The projected borrowing for the energy cap is £240BN over two years, what is borrowing going to be for the tax giveaway?
You said in comparison that the energy borrowing will relatively small, so other borrowing (for the tax giveaway?) will be way more than £240BN?
A lot of hot air is being expended about the binning of the 45% rate, the cost of that is actually relatively small at £2.2BN.
 

Alistair20000

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The projected borrowing for the energy cap is £240BN over two years, what is borrowing going to be for the tax giveaway?
You said in comparison that the energy borrowing will relatively small, so other borrowing (for the tax giveaway?) will be way more than £240BN?
A lot of hot air is being expended about the binning of the 45% rate, the cost of that is actually relatively small at £2.2BN.
Correct on the direct cost of abolishing the 45% rate. It’s impact on the government borrowing requirement is negligible. If the beneficiaries buy lots of designer clothes and other luxury goods with the largesse the net cost will be less. But why let actual figures get in the way ?

As Jinxy posted, goodies for the Great Unwashed will be offered closer to the next GE to maximise the effect.
 

Spanks

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If the numbers aren't huge Al, how much is going to trickle down?

Or are they playing smoke and mirrors?
 
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