Politics Today

angelic upstart

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It’s quite alarming that the CO2 supply in this country which is critical in food production & healthcare is dependent on the whim of a private foreign owned company.
I'm not sure we Brits own much that could be considered critical. This needs to change.
 

Mr Jinx

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Kier has just released a document on his "Vision for Labour".

John McDonnell was quick off the mark to rubbish it calling it a long essay unlikely to inspire voters and likening it to "the Sermon on the Mount written by a focus group".

You go girl! Handbags at dawn.
 

tavyred

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Kier has just released a document on his "Vision for Labour".

John McDonnell was quick off the mark to rubbish it calling it a long essay unlikely to inspire voters and likening it to "the Sermon on the Mount written by a focus group".

You go girl! Handbags at dawn.
A big conference week for Sir Keith ahead. Looks like he is going to test his authority over the party with his attempt to change how the leader is chosen, he’s apparently trying to revert back to the system which gives the parliamentary party a very big say into who gets the top job. There will be a large part of the rank and file who will fight this change rigorously.
It won’t have helped that Rayner gave a rumbustious performance in PMQ’s yesterday, she was a bit ‘class war’ for my taste, but it would’ve gone down well with the hard left of the party, especially a large part of the membership who view Starmer as ineffective, wishy washy and bordering on a Blairite. He obviously needs a good conference leader’s speech as well.
 

Mr Jinx

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He obviously needs a good conference leader’s speech as well.
I think as far as Sir K goes, anything will be too little too late. He's not going to tear it up with a barnstorming speech. Even if he does, lots of people and especially the right leaning media will just dismiss it as contrived.

He just isn't the man but Labour are probably stuck with him until the next election. And let's face it, whoever is at their helm at the next GE it's merely a damage limitation exercise. They'll probably still lose, just a question of how many seats they can claw back. Given boundary changes and voter registration is in the offing, it's unlikely to be that many. 10-20 I am guessing. The Tories biggest threat is probably the Lib Dems in patches down South.
 

tavyred

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I think as far as Sir K goes, anything will be too little too late. He's not going to tear it up with a barnstorming speech. Even if he does, lots of people and especially the right leaning media will just dismiss it as contrived.

He just isn't the man but Labour are probably stuck with him until the next election. And let's face it, whoever is at their helm at the next GE it's merely a damage limitation exercise. They'll probably still lose, just a question of how many seats they can claw back. Given boundary changes and voter registration is in the offing, it's unlikely to be that many. 10-20 I am guessing. The Tories biggest threat is probably the Lib Dems in patches down South.
I do wonder if prioritising the leadership election changes are an admission by Starmer that he isn’t the man to win and it’s important that the next man/woman in charge is not some sort of unelectable darling of the hard left.
FWIW, I do think Starmer needs to reference England specifically in his speech and a bit like Kinnock did, speak directly to the country and admit that he has a problem with an out of touch far left rump in his party.
 

DB9

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Labour do have a tradition of letting a leader fight a GE, sometimes two then if he or she fails out they go, I think the Tories didn't even give IDS that chance, They got rid forthwith. I thought Rayner v Raab was interesting and Ms Rayner did a pretty good job on him.
 

Mr Jinx

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I do wonder if prioritising the leadership election changes are an admission by Starmer that he isn’t the man to win and it’s important that the next man/woman in charge is not some sort of unelectable darling of the hard left.
Possibly, but given that Kier himself is not exactly hard left, I don't see why he should.

I think Corbyn was a bit of an aberration; Labourites just got swept up in the whole romance of it. Until it turned to dung that is. Burnham, if he does end up being the next chosen one, certainly isn't what I'd consider hard left.
 

DB9

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Possibly, but given that Kier himself is not exactly hard left, I don't see why he should.

I think Corbyn was a bit of an aberration; Labourites just got swept up in the whole romance of it. Until it turned to dung that is. Burnham, if he does end up being the next chosen one, certainly isn't what I'd consider hard left.
The UK is neither hard left or right, We're centralist nation historically and while the odd left or right leader is voted to lead a party, Very rarely do they win power, Labour has to admit the man who won 3 GE's was Blair and people voted for him.
 

Mr Jinx

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The UK is neither hard left or right, We're centralist nation historically and while the odd left or right leader is voted to lead a party, Very rarely do they win power
And it's fairly evident that it's not right or left that wins power, but personality/charisma of the leader:

Blair v Major - no contest
Blair v Hague - no contest
Blair v Howard - no contest (despite Iraq)
Cameron v Brown - no contest (although Clegg spoiled the party somewhat)
Cameron v Miliband - no contest
May v Corbyn - close call, Jezza by a nose
Boris v Corbyn - no contest

Anyone out there thinking Boris v Starmer might not follow suit?
 
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