Tagg's Trust AGM speech - 3 option

[grecian-near-hell]

As I've said, my heart is at SJP and I have no desire to move. But someone needs to be exploring these options and building business cases for various scenarios, if nothing else to rule them out.

As much as I agree with much of what you said, to employ 'Business consultant costs money, and in some instances stupid money We employed consultants years ago to look at the opportunities available and we are still at SJP with less opportunities available to us and having shed out thousands. Whilst it would be prudent to put together professional business cases they should only be employed with a view to the club definitely moving away from SJP due to the cost involved unfortunately a catch 22 scenario.

The other questions we need to be asking ourselves is what size of stadium is needed for this huge demographic that will be presenting itself to watch ECFC, according to the local council we are already there https://exeter.gov.uk/business/relocating-to-exeter/exeter-economy-in-numbers/ and how many are turning up each week now? What is going to make these other people want to attend other than success on the pitch, which we are being told is costing us half a million more than we get through our current income sources. If we can put on a thousand on our gates regularly this would give nearly £400,000 a year extra enabling us to just about balance the books, without having to rely on selling players.

Last season our average attendance was 4418 and this year it is currently 5124, 700 up, admittedly we have played the local clubs FGR Cheltenham and Swindon and some other team in Cornwall, that said the Vegans and Cheltenham never bring that many. This is still well short of our alleged capacity of 8000 approx, so why the need for a bigger stadium? The momentum is there we just need to market the end product better and sustain it, before we think about moving to a larger stadium. Is this even needed as there are still things we could do to the ground to increase capacity like filling in 'the gap' next to the NOG, or filling in the corners of the stands to allow for viewing, I don't know how many it would add but hopefully 1500-2000 but would only be worthwhile if the area was to be filled.

Why do we need a new Stadium to put on concerts? Couldn't we use SJP for this, although what damage to the pitch would this cause and presumably to the pitch of a new stadium. Conference facilities? How much are you going to make from these and why can't we look at the existing buildings around SJP to be converted for these and marketed accordingly as people have said it is ideally situated in the City centre.

I think Mr Tagg is possibly a bit presumptive and it may be he wants to put together another five year plan, which should start at increasing income to enable and sustain success on the pitch then stadium options

 

[DB9]

A couple of genuine questions for all those who suggest moving to a new development/stadium.

1. What size piece of land would be required, minimum and maximum, to facilitate any new stadium and to achieve anything like we now have? Where is this land, that isn't being snapped up for housing, builders have much deeper pockets than ECFC have, or ever will have!

2. What is the 'estimated' [not back of a fag packet] cost to ECFC of any project, include acquisition of land and building costs?

Answer to both, Far too much than we could ever afford

 

[Legohead]

Not to stay afloat as such. Just that the playing budget will have to be reduced therefore becoming less competitive in regards success on the pitch. Probably having to rely more on our youngsters, possibly before they are ready for league football.

Ah thanks Rosencrantz. So if I think rightly we are exceeding our playing budget currently and if we don't continue to bring in a certain amount of money then the playing budget will be have to be reduced to a level which is then sustainable? Meaning currently we aren't being run sustainably due to our overspending due to the pursuit of success?

 

[Rosencrantz]

Ah thanks Rosencrantz. So if I think rightly we are exceeding our playing budget currently and if we don't continue to bring in a certain amount of money then the playing budget will be have to be reduced to a level which is then sustainable? Meaning currently we aren't being run sustainably due to our overspending due to the pursuit of success?

It's a tricky balance to strike. We aren't spending money we don't have as it is in the bank from previous windfalls (was it the Olly transfer in particular?) and spread over a number of seasons (3) to give us a competitive playing budget to look for promotion. So it is not putting the club in danger, but also is not truly sustainable as further windfalls are not guaranteed. I can easily see Ampadu playing out his career at Chelsea for example so although we would get some appearance money, we would not get a major sell on windfall.

If we want to be sustainable with a more competitive base budget, we have to increase income away from "football" profits. Our base budget would put us in the lower parts of League 2 although that's not to say we couldn't still challenge at the top end. It was just be more unlikely without more proven players and you would even more of a problem then keeping hold of good players on lower contracts than we have now.

 

[Boyo]

So are you saying Boyo that currently we as a club are spending way above our budget on playing staff and if we continue to do so then we will require X amount of money from various sources just to stay afloat?

We are using money in the bank from previous transfer income to pay for an inflated playing budget until the end of next season. At that point the money runs out, meaning we have to reduce the playing budget by c£500k per year.

 

[Rosencrantz]

I think Taggy is correct to outline the options for increasing income to grow the club to the Trust. It would be helpful to know how close we are to maximising our non matchday income (certainly the Centre Spot has room for improvement) and what figures are possible if we do maximise that area.

As for the stadium idea, with the local councils starting to think about this "Greater Exeter" including entertainment plans, it would be foolish to ignore anything we could take advantage of and miss the boat. It should be kept on the table as an option should any opportunity arise.

 

[Legohead]

It's a tricky balance to strike. We aren't spending money we don't have as it is in the bank from previous windfalls (was it the Olly transfer in particular?) and spread over a number of seasons (3) to give us a competitive playing budget to look for promotion. So it is not putting the club in danger, but also is not truly sustainable as further windfalls are not guaranteed. I can easily see Ampadu playing out his career at Chelsea for example so although we would get some appearance money, we would not get a major sell on windfall.

If we want to be sustainable with a more competitive base budget, we have to increase income away from "football" profits. Our base budget would put us in the lower parts of League 2 although that's not to say we couldn't still challenge at the top end. It was just be more unlikely without more proven players and you would even more of a problem then keeping hold of good players on lower contracts than we have now.

I understand Rosencrantz thanks. Personally I feel that if we cannot secure further profits / extra revenue going forward then we have no option but to reduce the playing budget and hope that has a minimal detriment to our league position. Obviously it will have an impact but I feel we would find our level and it would still be as a competitive league 2 club.

In league 2 there will always be clubs with a bigger budget than most who underachieve. Scunny are one for sure. There will be clubs with next to no budget who overachieve like Macclesfield for example so there are always quite a few clubs who don't adhere to expectations. There will always be clubs like Morecambe who are trying to stave off relegation every season too but arguably these are poorly run small clubs with behind the scenes complications.

A small club on a small budget with the right management team in place at a harmonious, structured and secure club can overachieve and I believe that we would be a secure mid table league 2 club anyway worse case scenario if our budget was slashed. Of course i'm sure many would disagree and that's fine. Hopefully we will never get to find that out as operating a club at the level it can afford is risky in terms of league position if not club security, but if that is to be our future should we have to cut playing budget and revenue streams dry up then so be it.

We enjoy the extra money for now and try to make the best use of it by getting promoted and it doesn't work out then we revert back to sustainable operation, budget accordingly and find our level. I don't see that we have much option but I don't see that it's as catastrophic as some fans predict. After all if you are a small, minimally spending club in league 2 you can survive and even challenge for promotion under optimum circumstances. If you are a small, minimally spending club in the Premier League then it's certain relegation. So in our league most clubs can beat each other on their day. This gives us a fighting chance to remain financially secure and still have a hope of competing at the same level we are at and also ensures we don't lose too many fans due to a perceived lack of ambition.

Rather that than Bury and the whole host of clubs in the EFL and National League currently languishing in positions they shouldn't be due gambling with their futures.

 

[IndoMike]

Error

 

[Boyo]

As much as I agree with much of what you said, to employ 'Business consultant costs money, and in some instances stupid money We employed consultants years ago to look at the opportunities available and we are still at SJP with less opportunities available to us and having shed out thousands. Whilst it would be prudent to put together professional business cases they should only be employed with a view to the club definitely moving away from SJP due to the cost involved unfortunately a catch 22 scenario.

Unless Taggy was merely shooting from the hip, then I'm assuming there must be some substance behind some of these ideas. Presumably conversations with the Council have occurred? Prior to going out to look for shiny consultants I'd like to see the Club / Trust do some fag packet calculations to present to the fans some possible scenarios. A few sentences from Tagg at the Trust AGM is not enough to make an informed decision. This thread is evidence that we care about this stuff and it's clearly critical to the future of the Club.

I think the Trust probably need to issue a statement on this and advise what if any process / plan is in place.

 

[Boyo]

I understand Rosencrantz thanks. Personally I feel that if we cannot secure further profits / extra revenue going forward then we have no option but to reduce the playing budget and hope that has a minimal detriment to our league position. Obviously it will have an impact but I feel we would find our level and it would still be as a competitive league 2 club.

In league 2 there will always be clubs with a bigger budget than most who underachieve. Scunny are one for sure. There will be clubs with next to no budget who overachieve like Macclesfield for example so there are always quite a few clubs who don't adhere to expectations. There will always be clubs like Morecambe who are trying to stave off relegation every season too but arguably these are poorly run small clubs with behind the scenes complications.

A small club on a small budget with the right management team in place at a harmonious, structured and secure club can overachieve and I believe that we would be a secure mid table league 2 club anyway worse case scenario if our budget was slashed. Of course i'm sure many would disagree and that's fine. Hopefully we will never get to find that out as operating a club at the level it can afford is risky in terms of league position if not club security, but if that is to be our future should we have to cut playing budget and revenue streams dry up then so be it.

We enjoy the extra money for now and try to make the best use of it by getting promoted and it doesn't work out then we revert back to sustainable operation, budget accordingly and find our level. I don't see that we have much option but I don't see that it's as catastrophic as some fans predict. After all if you are a small, minimally spending club in league 2 you can survive and even challenge for promotion under optimum circumstances. If you are a small, minimally spending club in the Premier League then it's certain relegation. So in our league most clubs can beat each other on their day. This gives us a fighting chance to remain financially secure and still have a hope of competing at the same level we are at and also ensures we don't lose too many fans due to a perceived lack of ambition.

Rather that than Bury and the whole host of clubs in the EFL and National League currently languishing in positions they shouldn't be due gambling with their futures.

I think we need to try and understand what people view as an acceptable Club to be. For many I think the key criteria would relate to league position. Most would recognise that there is a strong correlation between playing budget and league position (there's always a few exceptions). I'm guessing here, but I estimate our current (inflated) playing budget would be ranked somewhere between 5-10 in L2 (Bottom 5 in L1). Our baseline budget (assuming we have no surplus cash from player sales etc) would probably be closer to 15-20 in L2.

If we are happy with that then we carry on as we are. We may enjoy the odd promotion and inevitable fall back to L2 and we'll have some hairy moments after a dry income spell. Relegation to the Conference would be a disaster and it would be really difficult to bounce back. Of course, each time a FGR or Salford get promoted, then we drop one place in the playing budget rankings.

If we want more than that, then ultimately we need to generate additional profit from somewhere. Match day income will largely correlate with on field performance and hence is vulnerable to decline following poor form and therefore is an unstable revenue stream to rely on.

Jesus I just reread what I wrote and I sound like Taggy! Anyway, I just want to know more about the options, as for me I think we can do better.