Politics Today

[Bittners a Legend]

Again, this desperation to put caveats on Britain's 'finest hour' is laughable. The whole period in the summer of 1940 has been defined as the "we stood alone" era and to drag up (as indomike did) the wonderfully laudable efforts of foreign pilots and now resistance fighters apparently as an example of Britain's inability to do anything on it own is again laughable, although not unsurprising in this Brexit era when there is political capital in portraying Britain as a little bit **** and unable to function outside of the EU's orbit.

I don't understand your post. "Desperation"? "Inability to do anything on our own". What on earth are you on about? Why will you not just read what I wrote rather than trying to find something to be offended by? I have no interest in adding caveats to anything, just reality. I'm simply stating factually that alongside the Poles already mentioned, many resistance movements across Europe aided us. The "we stood alone" refers to the fact that we had not been successfully invaded by Germany. As rhetoric it works wonderfully. The point is as simple as we did receive assistance. So as not to risk hurting your feelings on this matter I could not have been clearer about Britain's achievements in 1940. As I've already stated, they were remarkable. I'm not playing them down, I'm simply acknowledging what actually happened. I'm not sure if you want to use the Battle of Britain to make some weird point about the EU. If you do then it simply isn't relevant. I have no idea why my post triggered you to describe me as desperate or my post as laughable.

 

[arthur]

Is Jason back yet? The Tory party as we know it is being laid waste by one D Cummings and I for one want to know what he thinks about all this. Crunch week it seems...

Johnson was supposed to be meeting the potential Tory rebels today. They were going to ask him what proposals he had for a deal with the EU which would therefore make No Deal more unlikely and make any rebellion of theirs unnecessary. Turns out he hasn't got any realistic proposals so rather than admit this to them, Cummings has told him to withdraw the whip from them all and thus deselect them.

Once Cummings has achieved his maximum disruption "smash everything up" aim of a No Deal Brexit he'll be off to spend more time with his upcoming operation. Johnson will be left with a ragbag party without any coherent ideological or organisational framework to underpin it. The Mayor of London Johnson (socially liberal, internationalist, relatively progressive) has got into bed with the dark side in order to win power. Once the Price of Darkness, who holds everything together with a ruthlessness that makes A Campbell look like Oliver Letwin, departs, Johnson will be left in the company of a motley collection of individuals he has little in common with, culturally, socially or politically..

 

[tavyred]

Bitts, I think you need to realise my posts on this subject have been in response to another poster. I didn't just start wobbling on about 1940 from nowhere, it was in response to someone who cited that period as another example of Britain needing help to survive. Again, it was someone else who made the comparison between 1940 and Brexit, I merely disagreed with that comparison.

 

[IndoMike]

You can't see what isn't there ? Change your reading material !!

Don't quite understand your 2nd comment, but never mind.

 

[Mr Jinx]

Johnson was supposed to be meeting the potential Tory rebels today. They were going to ask him what proposals he had for a deal with the EU which would therefore make No Deal more unlikely and make any rebellion of theirs unnecessary. Turns out he hasn't got any realistic proposals so rather than admit this to them, Cummings has told him to withdraw the whip from them all and thus deselect them.

Once Cummings has achieved his maximum disruption "smash everything up" aim of a No Deal Brexit he'll be off to spend more time with his upcoming operation. Johnson will be left with a ragbag party without any coherent ideological or organisational framework to underpin it. The Mayor of London Johnson (socially liberal, internationalist, relatively progressive) has got into bed with the dark side in order to win power. Once the Price of Darkness, who holds everything together with a ruthlessness that makes A Campbell look like Oliver Letwin, departs, Johnson will be left in the company of a motley collection of individuals he has little in common with, culturally, socially or politically..

What would be the point of them meeting? Their views on Brexit are diametrically opposed; there is no common ground and neither will there be.

I think they are now realising their time as an MP is soon coming to an end. They can only speed the whole process up by voting with Corbyn in the forthcoming vonc. Bozza has them trapped.

 

[IndoMike]

I don't understand your post. "Desperation"? "Inability to do anything on our own". What on earth are you on about? Why will you not just read what I wrote rather than trying to find something to be offended by? I have no interest in adding caveats to anything, just reality. I'm simply stating factually that alongside the Poles already mentioned, many resistance movements across Europe aided us. The "we stood alone" refers to the fact that we had not been successfully invaded by Germany. As rhetoric it works wonderfully. The point is as simple as we did receive assistance. So as not to risk hurting your feelings on this matter I could not have been clearer about Britain's achievements in 1940. As I've already stated, they were remarkable. I'm not playing them down, I'm simply acknowledging what actually happened. I'm not sure if you want to use the Battle of Britain to make some weird point about the EU. If you do then it simply isn't relevant. I have no idea why my post triggered you to describe me as desperate or my post as laughable.

As he did with me, he twists your words to make you seem ant-British. He thinks that lie wins him the argument. He also forgets that at the time we had an Empire. Does he really think that England alone could have defended England and our Empire alone? Why is it so shameful to accept that other countries helped us (which they did).? We still fought bravely, and Churchill is one of my heroes (much to the chagrin of a few posters on EW).Churchill was desperate for the Yanks to join the Allies.

 

[IndoMike]

As he did with me, he twists your words to make you seem ant-British. He thinks that lie wins him the argument. He also forgets that at the time we had an Empire. Does he really think that England alone could have defended England and our Empire alone? Why is it so shameful to accept that other countries helped us (which they did).? We still fought bravely, and Churchill is one of my heroes (much to the chagrin of a few posters on EW).Churchill was desperate for the Yanks to join the Allies.
To keep repeating his accusation that we hate the UK makes me think he's just a WUM. If that's how he gets his kicks, that's up to him.

 

[arthur]

What would be the point of them meeting? Their views on Brexit are diametrically opposed; there is no common ground and neither will there be.

I think they are now realising their time as an MP is soon coming to an end. They can only speed the whole process up by voting with Corbyn in the forthcoming vonc. Bozza has them trapped.

I suppose there isn't much common ground - the rebels voted three times to approve Brexit, while members of the current regime defied the whip and voted for it just the once, at most.

Their time as Conservative MPs is indeed coming to an end as the Conservative Party has become a cult and they won't want to be part of it. It is unthinkable that they would stand on a No Deal manifesto so whether they quit voluntarily or are deselected makes little difference. It would be interesting if the liberal Tory MPs, representing affluent London commuter belt seats, stood as Independent Conservatives in the forthcoming election and came to an agreement with the Lib Dems. After all, as Michael Gove observed, nobody voted for No Deal...

And all this Corbyn bogeyman stuff is so much testicles. He is an irrelevance. Who is trapped? There will be a general election - No Deal or Remain and the people will get to choose.. We'll all be happy with that and the subsequent outcome no doubt

 

[IndoMike]

I suppose there isn't much common ground - the rebels voted three times to approve Brexit, while members of the current regime defied the whip and voted for it just the once, at most.

Their time as Conservative MPs is indeed coming to an end as the Conservative Party has become a cult and they won't want to be part of it. It is unthinkable that they would stand on a No Deal manifesto so whether they quit voluntarily or are deselected makes little difference. It would be interesting if the liberal Tory MPs, representing affluent London commuter belt seats, stood as Independent Conservatives in the forthcoming election and came to an agreement with the Lib Dems. After all, as Michael Gove observed, nobody voted for No Deal...

And all this Corbyn bogeyman stuff is so much testicles. He is an irrelevance. Who is trapped? There will be a general election - No Deal or Remain and the people will get to choose.. We'll all be happy with that and the subsequent outcome no doubt

Ironic that Camerion and indeed May wanted to unite the party, yet they've made it even more disunited.
However, expecting career politicians to renounce their career on a matter of principle might be a bit of a stretch

 

[elginCity]

I note the Brexit Broadcasting Corporation is indulging in a spot of 'Project Fear'; could 'No-Deal' be a bridge too far for them ?

No-deal Brexit could hit house prices